@Neon_Knight: Yeah, you've got a point there.

I think it's hard to replicate correctly the feel of a game in a different engine, because it's not always about the weapons but it also involves the physics and many other things. It's already extremely hard to do so between games running under different versions of practically the same engine (UT → UT2k[x] → UT3), let alone between two games who share nothing in common, technically wise (UE[x] → IdTech[x]).

As a long time UT player I have seen tons of conversion mods and mutators from UT to UT2004 to UT3 or the inverse, and as far as I'm concerned, none of them managed to catch well that style.

@Neon_Knight: But don't you think a UT Mod would work well? It wouldn't feel the same but still could work.

Unfortunately, as much of an UT fan I am, I have to agree.

Facing Worlds worked in the Unreal series because of the Translocator and the Redeemer, both of which served to make life hell for the snipers/campers. You know, the countermeasure.

Unfortunately, there's no Translocator equivalent in Q3A (the dummied out Grappling Hook doesn't count), and not even the overpowered BFG or the TA weapons can do anything about campers/snipers in such a map, so this conversion is bound to failure, regardless of how well/faithfully to the original is done.

Facing Worlds is my favorite UT CTF map :). And i finally can play it on quake 3 :).

I got this one years ago. From what I remember this was one lousy conversion. As if the UT map is that good.
This one had horrible lighting to start with, and the insides were VERY cramped. You almost had room to move around. The towers were also smaller, iirc, which made the whole feel of the level even worse. 0_° ..
The skybox was a big joke. At least UT's is convincing. There's depth.

One of the worst ut-Q3 conversions. But, if you're still (ut and q3 are getting old) addicted to face, well, you won't mind this flawed level and play it anyway...>_< But I'll gladly pass.

omg.....thank you.....thankyousomuch!

i liked the ut version better

how the hell do you get the quad damage and regen? i tried rocket jumping for ages..??

most ugly map i've seen

Im an UT player too and i always hated this map. I hate snipers so i hate face. i dunno how it plays in q3 but would be the same suckage im sure

heey this is off ut

ne1 got a good lvl i should download?

This level was too big. Although it was about the same size as face, q3 feels slower to me. The colours looked washed out too. Change the skybox light tone to a yellow one, that is if you are still making changes. THe new tone will make the colours much richer and make it look a hell of a lot nicer. Use yellow light rather than white light in general when making levels. It looks 1000000 times better, although it should be (255 255 100) or somthing so its more of a creamy colour.

I don't know about you all, but I think it kicks! I know it's off UT, but it was awesome in there, and it's just as good here. Q3A with my fav UT level. Rapture.

I would have to say that this is the best CTF level ever. That's right.

In UT, it is balanced in every way. Even the snipers are in peril if they do not move constantly.

I love that it's now for Q3A as well. HooAhh.

Like UT this map is also bad and to simple :(

Speaking of UT,that reminds me to give the finger to these guys that brouht to you TA. Run out of ideas,i guess.As for 1,27g, it sucks.Q3A is one thing,TA is another.Questions?

Can anyone say unreal !

group of about 12 of us play this regualarly. it's a hoot. I actually like this better than the UT version.

Where to begin?

1 - Overlapping brushes causing z fighting over the place

2- Lighting in the red base over accentuated

3 - Missing textures behind the blue base (didn't check red side)

That's about it for the bad.

Here's the good:

1 - It's as good as a remake for anything from UT can get.

2 - The lay-pout was just about perfect.

3 - Textures looked "ok" (with exception of the missing one)

4 - Sky looked killer

All I can say is, it won't stay on my hard drive.

-Sorry

Works better in UT than Q3...this one eats FPS, almost unplayable in parts.

This is a keeper!

grrr! face is the reason why UT servers are full of respawn camping newbies.. stay away from it

Thanks Bauul, I'll try it out!

Ok Mark, here goes:

When setting up a server yourself to run this map on any system (LAN/Internet or whatever) you need to put in the console /sv_pure 0. This tells Quake 3 you are running custom maps. Or you can start a game using the menus. Contrary to the readme, the name of the map file is facer2d, not facingworlds are whatever I first intended the map file to be called.

when joining a game, all you have to do is join, nothing more is required.

Hope this helps!

Ok Mark, here goes:

When setting up a server yourself to run this map on any system (LAN/Internet or whatever) you need to put in the console /sv_pure 0.

Hi,

Err, how do I get this to work? I don't understand the "start a server with +set sv_pure 0" . Does this mean a multiplayer/LAN server? Any help would be appreciated!

good stuff!

The only reason I play Q3 more than UT is becuase Q3 loads up quicker. :)

Thats it i am fed up of people calling UT slow it is 100000000 times better than q3 and remember you can set it for turbo speed. Not go to my site www.quake-planet.co.uk

ps i do like q3 though

Thats it i am fed up of people calling UT slow it is 100000000 times better than q3 and remember you can set it for turbo speed. Not go to my site www.quake-planet.co.uk

ps i do like q3 though

HO..

^__^...good jod

Nobody know how much work it is to make a map... I tried it with Worldcraft in q1-times and they were quite ok, but I really don't get along with that thingy id published...

Your map looks great, give it an 8, but I didn't even like UT nor did I like the map in UT (hate snipers..) giving it a 3.

So I'd give ur map a better grade than the ut-remake :)

To Ultron

I do use that system! Why do you think the puplished version of FW was named Facer2d? Might it be becuase the previous version were Facera, facerb, facerc, facerd, Facer2a, Facer2b and Facer2c? Nah, what was I thinking?

Ok, I'm doing I'm compiling a big update now. New effects, weapon positions alterd, and slightly larger insides for free-er movement. Hopefully this update should make it more accurate finished thing.

Ok, so this is turning out like a BETA test site now.

Ok I am an active Q3 and UT player.This is how I see it.Q3 DM rules!!!! There is no better DM.Fast and deadly.UTDM bites bad!Slow.BUT,UT has the better ctf.Q3 CTF is an abomination what a turd!I dont know why they even included it.It was an after thought to be competitive with UT.Thats why the addon pack is comeing out you idiots, its stuff to mimick UTCTF.Make the Q3 version worth playing.UTCTF rules.MY clan the [DJIN] are a UTCTF,Q3DM,and Q3Fortress clan.I personally hate Face it is the most played out map there is.Everyone loves it.But unfortunately the physics in UT and Q3 are too different to make the maos convert.So why dont we just stop doing it.I dont care how good they look they ALL dont work its stupid.Leave them where they belong.Besides if ya want to play a real team work games,Since CTF is really DM with flags try Q3A fortress it is the bomb!Lots of halflife tfc map conversions that work very well with the quake engine.(same mindset in programming I suppose,with similar physiscs.You shoug go to www.fileleech.com and get it right now!!!

Camping involved hiding spots. There aren't any in Face. There are plenty of opportunities to snipe, which Rail hounds will always enjoy.

The map size is fine. It's better than I thought a Face conversion would be. You really did a great first effort with it. I know it's not your first map but it's a good conversion. There are, of course, a number of differences within Q3A that change the dynamics of the map. But it's still quite playable. I know the strafe jumpers will love climbing up those hills to the other side.

In the future, I'd recommend making revisions to your map projects like mapname1a, mapname1b, etc as you go along. This helps you go through betas as you build and save them. Then you can release a beta map with whatever number/letter extension and weed out problems. The final version would then be named without the number/letter at the end.

Right now if you had to remake your map, you'd have to either use the same name and maybe end up with version conflicts for those who don't have the latest version. Or you'd have to rename the new map to a different name.

Anyhow, just more constructive criticism. I got a 4 for my DM17 conversion to UT, even though it looked pretty good. Dimensions were off but it was quite recognizable and playable.

Anyhow don't be discouraged by those that disagree with you, however harshly. You've done good work.

bleh.....can't even select it from the menu. pk3 file and bsp are same name but different than in the readme.DOC <---who makes .doc readme's?! i could never even load it. maybe i'm stupid, maybe I'm lazy....probably a combination of the two. But good lord, make it selectable from the menu. I mean damn....

Uh... and there are no camping llamas playing Q3? :P

Besides, it's a CTF map. There's no such thing as camping in a CTF map.

I was asked to make this map. I didnt ant to since I seen this map played in UT at a LAN. its all camping and snipering. lame as hell. for Q3 is not gonna work at all unless you get a whole bunch of camping llamas from ut community to play it. they'll like it since all they do is camp camp camp.

The death throguh falling. It is impossible to survive. There are numerous damage burshes around the towers to stop you from jumping off. The simple reason is the fact that in quake III it is impossible to lose more than 10% health through a big drop. This would completely alter any stratagy for the map, and remove some key elements, whihc is why I did it.

The quad and regen are impossible to get, I put them there at the very last second as decoration. blue quad for blue team, red regen for red team. If people want, I'll replace the regen with a quad and make them accesible in the update.

The teleporters were not centerd because of appalling bot problmes with them, which resulted in me having to seal off the tele's from the bots compltetely, I'll put them center if you want.

The weapon placements are a good suggestion.

And the entire map is smaller. Even though tig said it was stupidly huge, it is actually smaller than the UT equvilient. I did this so Q3 could cope with the map. I could make the back wall further back, but nothing else, as the insode room does span the entire width of the tower.

The missing texutres will be fixed, that was me being dumb.

I agree with Tig about not e-mailing him hate mail over a map. If you don't like the review, post it here. But be civil. The board and his inbox are not your stomping ground for obscenities or indecent exposure.

I did a count on the number of UT and Q3A maps, and UT has 4 times as many DM maps, and 10 times as many CTF maps as Q3A.

Unreal Tournament - PlanetUnreal
DM 1177
CTF 403
DOM 151
AS 69

Quake3Arena - LvL
DM 290 - 114 are also Tourney maps
CTF 45

Not complaining here, or talking about quality. But quantity. These stats may rely heavily on ease of use for the map editor for each game.

I think it is a great challenge for people to make good maps for Q3A. I think Bauul should be recognized for honestly trying to make a good Q3A map out of a great UT map.

But to make an exacting duplicate is next to impossible, and the unique physics of each game change the gameplay of similar maps. Plus the weapons are different in many ways.

I give Bauul a big robot thumbs up for making a great attempt. While not perfect, there's no mistaking where it originated from. With some more work the map could be quite playable.

Let me go though a laundry list real quick of some errors I found:

1. Ledges too high. One tactic in UT is to scale down the side with the flag. Doing so here will kill you, even if you start out with 200 health and 200 armor. A fix here would be to make more ledges.

1. No way to too get to the Quad. Since there's no such thing as a Translocator in Q3A, the Quad placement is impossible to get to. I would suggest moving the platform down so a Rocket Jump can reach it.

1. The red team doesn't get a Quad, but the Regen. Make sure a Quad is available on both sides.

1. Some of the teleporters aren't centered in the alcoves.

1. The missing texture is an obvious fix.

1. The Superhealth bridge should be removed and, if possible, the land should be moved a little closer to each other so a person won't have to slow down just to get the Superhealth.

1. While I don't think the Shotgun is a bad weapon, it should be put inside the base. As for the Grenade Launchers, I think that two are enough for the map, and that the Rail Guns should be put on one of the back sides of each base as in UT's Facing Worlds map.

1. It's cumbersome inside. There's not enough room to fight.

Anyhow, the map has potential that 2-3 more hours of work could fix. If Bauul doesn't finish work on this map then someone else should.

I give this map a 6 as it stands, as it really only needs some easy tweaking to make it much more playable.

Just so you know, that e-mail was not from me....even though you stated my name there Tigger-oN. (heehee) ---oh, and I'll D/L this map and try it as I am a CTF man, but IMHO i think maps should stay with the games they are designed for. (that goes for any ~fool~ out there thinking of making ANOTHER Dead Simple map.......

heh, if other UT ctf maps look like this i suggest that epic start a new hobby cause the playability is just ass. Looks nice tho, good work Bauul, but next time make a map from scratch.

I got some great feedback about this map, the fool emailed it to, so I'll just post it, plus the messgae headers so everyone can see.

-------------------------------------------------
Received: from oemcomputer (151.203.194.235) by mail0.mailsender.net (5.1.034)
Message-ID: <000801bfdba6$45859660$9680fea9@oemcomputer>
From: "Webmaster(Quan)" <webmaster@planetquan.com>
To: <tigger@ebom.org>
Subject: dont fuck with facing worlds
Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:29:34 -0400

its wayyy better than any Quake map... so go fuck yourself... asshole
------------------------------------------------

If I get one more high quality piece of feedback sent to me about this map I'll remove this map from ..::LvL - I don't need this crap in my mail, keep it on the site or keep it to your self.

the first part of the back of each base that sticks out has a missing texture, the back of the inside of each base is too big and the sides of the inside are too small, you get too much speed going downhill in the center, if you look at the center from the BFG or sniper points, it looks fuxored. The map should be rotating, the shotguns are obselete.

There are textures in the front of the bases are that are colliding, if you even attempted to make the part where the damage amplifier is in UT, then you can't get to it with a rocket jump or anything.

Some of my strategies, don't work in it because where the brushes stick out on the side are all at the wrong places so you can't try to hop down from the top of the bases

IMHO, I give it a 1 for effort and 1 for creativity and

it deserves a 0, this map was made for UT only because of the physics and limits of the UT engine

This map 0wnz!

Another thing; it seems that the interior of each building is far too small compared to the original ( may not seem like a huge deal, but it does make an impact in terms of gameplay )

I also noticed other faults, but you already know about them via others here, so no need to repeat :)

Decent idea, but this one is better off in UT than Q3 IMO; a 6 it is.

I don't know about the missing texture on the back of one of the towers, can you tell me which one (r or b) please!

And you know what dinwitty, I thought it would be one meg too. Nice and simple map. It ain't. It's bloody complex. There is not a vertical wall anywhere in the towers, every single bursh is slanted at an angle.

I'll have a look at it, if someone gives me the poition of the missing tezture, I'll fix the clip brushes and get rid of the z-fighting and post an update.

sorry bauul, I thought that was the reviewer

4 megs? UT Face is hardly one meg!
something is definately different between the 2 games
as UT Face doesnt need that much room unless textures are stored in the level also.

A Q3a version of facing worlds?

Me wanna try!

hey bauul, run UT and try it in UT and tell us what you think (The UT version, dont be biased because its UT either)

From the picture it looks the same :-) thats about as close as I will get though as my Q3a CD has gone belly up :-(

I've been petitioning for a Q3A Facing Worlds map for months. Thank you for making one! I'll check it out tonight. The one thing I found lacking in Q3A was good CTF maps. Making two of their four CTF maps directly from DM maps was blatantly obvious, too. Q3A has to rely on custom maps to breathe life into it's CTF. And suprisingly there have been a good number of CTF maps for Q3A.

Anyhow, I really hope this map plays well in Q3A. I know the Rail hounds will love it.

Cool map, but it just wasn't meant to be in Quake 3.. I think I'll stick with UT for this one.

"Facing Worlds" was my favorite map from UT. Now I can uninstall that substandard graphical, ultra long loading, frustration machine. THANK YOU BAUUL!!!!!!

I feel that this map has problems, and many of them, there is a missing texture on the back of the outside of the base. And you need to clip brush the inside of the bases, I get stuck during flagruns......

I'll just say: No, just... no.

I'm sorry about the brush alignments, it was extremely hard to get Quake III to deal with all the fancy shapes of the buildings. The asteroid itself was a nightmare trying to get alinged properly. Yeah it was ahrd, but I'm reasnably satisfied with it.

Did you create the textures yourself? If so I am impressed.

The map itself has some technical problems, though:
-overlapping brushes on the ground in front of the towers
(I noticed that this doesn't show really good on all videocards, it didn't show as clearly e.g. on my old TNT2, so that's why you could have missed it)
-textures missing at the back of one of the towers
-some brushes do not line up perfectly

Apart from the technical problems this one is a very good conversion of one of the cooler UT maps (the best by far is the monastery like, don't know what it's called).

Good job, although I wished you'd get rid of the technical issues.

Texture difficulties? Gimme a break, I spent months on the frigging textures.

Admittedly, Face was the Sole half-decent map in UT, but it did cater to campers a huge amount. In addition, this port is exceptionally bad, with clipping problems and texture difficulties.

Asides which, why would us Q3A people want a UT map? The idea is repulsive. 3/10 for selection.

'Facing Worlds' was my favorite UT map. I spent hours with a sniper rifle and redeemer, and now I can delete UT altogether because this map lets me have all the original fun with a much better engine. woohoo!

Im giving this a 'make-you-feel-kinda-warm-inside' 10.

Damn do I ever suck at making maps!